Throttle Body Sync & Idle Setting Difficulty -> New Beru Coils

[edbikerii]

Good afternoon,

My bike was getting small popping into the exhaust, was not running as smoothly as I felt it should, was idling somewhat erratically, and when I used the cold-start lever it just wasn't keeping the RPM up enough when cold, such that I had to hold it in the cold-start position for a while to get her running. The red battery light would stay on after the biked started up, until I blipped the throttle, too. 2004 R1150R with around 32,000 miles.

So, long story short, I felt that I needed to do the basic maintenance of adjusting the valve clearances and then syncing the throttle bodies. The valves were all in spec, as well as the rocker arm shaft end-play. Spark plugs looked fine. So, I got my trusty EMGO carburetor synchronizer gauges out, noted that all of the rubber hoses were old & cracked after more than 23 years of use on all of my carbureted bikes, replaced the hoses as needed, and went at it.

However, the throttle bodies just didn't seem to want to be synced. I found that the idle speed adjustment with the Big Brass Screw was not even working properly on the right side. Started to make me worry that the throttle bodies were somehow screwed up. I removed the screws and cleaned them, but this made no difference. I checked that both exhaust pipes were heating evenly, and they were, so no misfire condition.

So, I got the idle as close to spot on as I could, and then moved on to sync the TBs at idle and then at 4K rpm.

Taking her for a ride, I still had popping in the exhaust, and the idle was not consistent. she just didn't feel right. The fast idle lever still didn't quite work right either.

After considerable googling, I stumbled upon someone else who had an issue with an ignition coil on an R1150R. I thought, "nah, it can't be ignition, because both cylinders are firing and the exhaust is getting nice & hot". But, since the check was so easy, I might as well give it a go. To my amazement, when I unplugged the right side spark plug, the engine continued to run exactly as it had been running before! The exhaust continued to get hot, etc. So, the right coil was a problem. Both cylinders were still firing because it has the DUAL SPARK system! However, the combustion in the right cylinder was apparently not complete.

So, I ordered the Beru metal-jacketed ignition coils, replaced the right one and verified an instant improvement, then I replaced the left one for good measure. I went ahead and synced the throttle bodies again, this time the idle speed screws worked perfectly. I removed the slack from the throttle cables in order to fix the fast idle lever operation, and then I synced the throttle bodies at idle and 4K rpm. The process was much faster and easier this time!

The results were astounding. She is like a new bike again.

[trickytree]

Interesting. I've got a almost identical problem but my stick coils are less than a year old so I dismissed them....pulling the bottom plug caps didn't make any difference. Both exhausts getting hot, no misfire but performance and fuel economy are down and I'm getting more vibrations than usual.
I'll check them out further.

[towerworker]

I agree......interesting. I'm not familiar with the Beru name although a web search brings up many hits. What did the pair of coils cost you? I bought the BMW coils many years back for about $230 for a pair.

[edbikerii]

$224.38 for the pair, shipped, eBay.

[sstein]

I've seen many threads about the stick coil issue. Just to clarify, does the 2002 also have stick coils or ignition coils? If so where are they located? I know that the 2002 is single Spark so is this something I don't have to worry about?

[trickytree]

I've seen many threads about the stick coil issue. Just to clarify, does the 2002 also have stick coils or ignition coils? If so where are they located? I know that the 2002 is single Spark so is this something I don't have to worry about?

Single sparks don't have stick coils, only the twin sparks are blessed with the bloody things.

[towerworker]

I've seen many threads about the stick coil issue. Just to clarify, does the 2002 also have stick coils or ignition coils? If so where are they located? I know that the 2002 is single Spark so is this something I don't have to worry about?

I'm pretty certain when I say the twin spark models started in 2004, at least in the US models. There is also a change in the plastic spark plug cover. The pre-2004 models have a plug cover that spans the length of the valve cover. The dual spark models start over the plug and go back to the back end of the valve cover. And on dual spark you have a second spark plug on the underside of the jug with a black plastic cover to shield the plug cap from road grime. I believe the early "stick coils" were poorly protected/shielded from heat. They had all manner of failures and caused much scratching of the head! The BMW replacements seem to be better protected. And to answer the above question the stick coils are in the plug cap/assembly itself. Mine is an '04 so it is dual spark. I've seen some threads on ADVRider on converting a stick coil machine to a conventional coil setup using a Ford F150 ignition coil system. A lot less $$ from what I understand. If mine ever fails again I may look into that.

[sstein]

Gotcha. Thanks.

[sstein]

Gotcha. Thanks.

[CycleRob]

Here is a much better way. Use inexpensive, proven, industrial grade, ultra reliabilable Ford coils and mount them AWAY from the very hot, enclosed area of the OilHead's cylinder head.
http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/c ... re.713106/

[sweatmark]

Here is a much better way. Use inexpensive, proven, industrial grade, ultra reliabilable Ford coils and mount them AWAY from the very hot, enclosed area of the OilHead's cylinder head.
http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/c ... re.713106/

I check that ADV topic thread regularly for new info.

IIRC, Roger RT has suggested that dual-spark bikes trigger both spark plugs simultaneously (main and secondary, or central plug and circumferential plug) for each cylinder. Since the secondary coil has single trigger wire circuit to ECU, then does that mean all four plugs fire simultaneiously in "lost spark" configuration? Anyone ever scope this and document?

There are 4-plug coil packs available for automotive applications, and perhaps the ultimate "coil sticks no more" setup would be single trigger wire >>> 4-plug coil pack >>> all the spark plugs in a dual-sparl oilhead.

[CycleRob]

If riders still have good stik coils, here is another really slick remove-your-stik-coils-from-head-heat mod:
http://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread ... ost3778322

You'll just need to add the secondary wires, sparkplug terminal caps, rubber secondary wire insulators and metal mounting clamps. That puts the existing stik coils in a much cooler, almost factory looking new location. Before installing the sparkplug wire terminal on each sparkplug I would first fabricate a terminal puller to reach down into the sparkplug tunnel so you do not have to pull on the secondary wire for spark plug maintenance.

[Roger 04 rt]

Here is a much better way. Use inexpensive, proven, industrial grade, ultra reliabilable Ford coils and mount them AWAY from the very hot, enclosed area of the OilHead's cylinder head.
http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/c ... re.713106/

I check that ADV topic thread regularly for new info.

IIRC, Roger RT has suggested that dual-spark bikes trigger both spark plugs simultaneously (main and secondary, or central plug and circumferential plug) for each cylinder. Since the secondary coil has single trigger wire circuit to ECU, then does that mean all four plugs fire simultaneiously in "lost spark" configuration? Anyone ever scope this and document?

There are 4-plug coil packs available for automotive applications, and perhaps the ultimate "coil sticks no more" setup would be single trigger wire >>> 4-plug coil pack >>> all the spark plugs in a dual-sparl oilhead.

Not a bad idea if your four plug coil stores enough energy for all 4 plugs in the dwell time allotted by the Motronic. You need to do a little engineering work to be sure.