`02 R1150R not starting.. fuel system issues?

[nathan]

800 miles into a planned 2 week bike trip and 1.8 miles after getting a full tank of gas, my 2002 R1150R quit running. I'm not sure if it was by coincidence, but it died right as I had given my luggage role a good firm pat to try to center it on the bike.

I had a similar issue happen on a hot summer day last year. After quite a bit of troubleshooting, I determined that it wasn't getting any spark and I replaced the coil with a used one. I used those same steps again this time to determine that the coil was getting juice but that the spark plugs weren't sparking. I sent my buddies on to Labrador without me, paid a local to trailer my bike back home and ordered a new coil .. which I was positive would fix the issue.

Here's where I start to get out of my level of expertise. I got the coil.. and now I have spark.. but the bike still won't fire. The facts as I have observed them are:

1) When turning the bike over, the spark plugs spark
2) The fuel pump whines when I turn the bike on
3) I still have a the same full tank of gas that I put only 1.8 miles on
4) I just changed the oil, adjusted the valves and synched the throttle bodies
5) I connected and disconnected the fuel disconnects several times and they lock into place well
6) I swapped the 1 & 2, 3 & 4 black relays but it made no difference
7) I pulled the injectors and when turning the bike over they spray just enough to wet my finger tips

After reading all of the forums, it sounds like I might have a weak fuel pump. Before I go spending $425 to replace it, does anyone have any other troubleshooting suggestions? Is it possible that it's a bad tank of gas or a clogged fuel filter?

Thanks!

[twindave]

If you determine it's the fuel pump, you can buy an entire kit for $145.00

http://www.beemerboneyard.com/16141341231rk.html

[Airman]

I'm voting for the bad fuel. A good rule of troubleshooting is to go back to the last time it was running right. Just before you put that full tank of fuel in. It's certainly easy to check. I saved my old plastic fuel disconnects for just such a job. You may have taken in a slug of water from that gas station.

[nathan]

I drained my full tank of gas, pulled the tank off the bike.. and when I opened her up I found that the fuel pump had become disconnected from the fuel filter??? I think I've learned two lessons here:

1) Don't just slide the hoses off of the fuel filter when changing it out.. replace the factory clamps with new ones. (Granted my last fuel filter change was a couple years ago).

2) When you get a new fuel filter as part of a service pack from a vendor, don't be a lazy bum because it's a pain in the butt to change... get over yourself and change the darn thing. (And use the new clamps that they sent .. they sent them for a reason).

I'm still positive that the coil was bad ... and I've talked myself into believing that the fuel filter likely became disconnected bouncing around in the back of a strangers pickup truck

Thanks for the help guys!

[boxermania]

Strange outcome as this is not a common occurrence.

I want to congratulate you on the excellent troubleshooting, that being said and for the benefit of other visitors that might come upon this thread you had an inkling of the problem after step #7.

A) You had a bad connection at the quick disconects - wrong, because they never came off after your refueling. B) The pump was weak, a possibility, specially if they are allowed to run on close to empty tanks as a matter of course (they are cooled by the gasoline) C) Something else pump related had to been the cause as you didn't get a good spray from the injectors.

Last but not least, the first thing I would have guessed at was water in the gas, as that has happened to me and friends, with both bikes and cars, specially in remote, out of the way stations, with little volume.

Glad that you are back on your two feet.......

[rich1kim]

You know.... I too have a '02 R1150R and that exact thing happended on my bike this weekend. It just coughed and quit running while I was on the passing lane of the New York State throughway. I filled her up at a gas station at a nearby town. It was raining hard, and after using about a gallon of fuel it happended. Thanks for your insight. I'll follow your steps and find the culprit.

Rich.

[Dr Adventure]

So here is an on-going saga with about the same conclusion (I think).

Last year I developed a "tank suction" problem, that is, I had a lot of vacuum in the tank to the point that opening the gas cap to put in fuel took some significant force on the gas cap. Air would rush in and the tank would visibly expand when I did finally open the gas cap. I attributed this at the time to a new o-ring seal at the gas cap itself, which I had replaced when I had put a new tankbag on that locks to the gas cap. Later I realized that this was probably not related to the new gas cap O-ring, and others have said on this forum that a clogged charcoal filter will cause this, but I did nothing (mistake #1).

Earlier this spring, my fuel level sensor came on and stayed on, despite the level of fuel in the tank. Suspecting a wiring problem, I too ignored this and just lived with it (mistake #2).

Two weeks ago, a day after a very nice 2-hour ride in the Pennsylvania farm land, my bike ('02 R1150R) would not start. The fuel pump was pumping, the kill switch, neutral switch, and side-stand switch were doing their jobs (killing power to the fuel pump), but my plugs were dry after repeatedly cranking. Checked the quick disconnects, etc..., but had no reason to suspect them. Did a thorough inspection of the wiring and could find nothing (the Motronic is such a mystery that I wasn't sure that a break in some electrical line wasn't causing some relay to close and keeping the injectors from firing).

Finally concluded that the problem must be in the tank. After getting the tank "drained" (it seems impossible to siphon all the gas out of the weirdly shaped tank) and open I found the same problem nathan found: the hose between the fuel pump and filter had come off at the fuel pump. Gas was just being recirculated in the tank -- none available to the injectors.

So my trip to Hermy's BMW this coming week will be a quest for a bunch of new hose clamps (not the original ones which seem tough to deal with), a new charcoal cannister, and a look at my fuel pump assembly to make sure they think all looks okay. (Is the fuel level sensor supposed to be so simple: open at the bottom with a "donut" that seems to ride up and down on a central shaft? This must be a capacitive sensor, but I would think it could be flapping around in there pretty good and give a positive (level low) reading under all kinds of conditions, low fuel or not!)

My theory for what went wrong: the charcoal cannister clogged (yet I can with a little difficulty pull some air through it by mouth -- I know, not recommended), causing the vacuum condition. The level sensor eventually failed under the vacuum conditions (not sure how, but hey, this is a theory). (I fear that there are still level sensor parts in the bottom of my tank somewhere. Anyone have a picture of what a working fuel level sensor is supposed to look like?) And finally, the hose between the pump and the filter worked itself off because the pressure in the hose was a good deal higher than the absolute pressure in the tank and forced off the hose. Note that the filter had been replaced 12,000 miles prevoiusly in fall 2007.

Of course I would welcome more experienced diagnosticians!

I will say this is the first time my RR has let me down in over 30,000 miles.

[Biff's R]

I had the same thing happen with the connection between the filter and the fuel pump about a year and a half ago. New filter installled by Mathais BMW on 1 hour notice.

Just a bit of advice on spark issues. Start at the plug and work your way back to the coil. I learned this on my old R65 after a $400 service. Bike was firing on one cylinder and replaced the coil then the wire. The nexxt year it did it again. I strarted with the plug, and then moved to the wire. $27 vs. $400.