Hi all. Am considering forking out a couple of hundred euros an an aftermarket eprom chip. Having had one in my old 1150gs a couple of years back I would say it was a worthwhile investment.
Was not expecting fireblade type performance but found that it made the bike more driveable with better throttle response throughout the whole rev range. Also eliminated popping and banging from the remus can.
Was wondering has anyone tried the wunderlich performance controller? Does it give the same bang for your buck as the chip?
They make some fairly impressive claims - 10% performance increase throughout the whole rev range, 12% faster revving etc.
Are these 300 euro add ons worth the money?
Any thoughts??
Performance upgrades
Moderator: Moderators
Re: Performance upgrades
No, I doubt the return on your performance investment would be worthwhile... That's strictly opinion, but didn't want you to feel ignored here!
Based on web heresay, it appears that BMW boxer performance know-how is limited to folks with racing programs, like San Jose BMW in the USA; more support and performance options appear to exist in Europe (eg. http://www.rennkuh.de). As for our R1150R.org group here, the most effective engine mods I'm aware of are those used by Oliver for his R1100R to yield solid rear wheel power and torque, according to his dyno chart. He has a distinct advantage of being close to the heart of the German boxer tuning crew, plus the aftermarket in Europe with all the cool parts.
For the rest of us, performance upgrades are mostly aftermarket exhausts (just for noise and some weight reduction), plus suspension upgrades. I've got one of Jens' fuel adder gizmos, but it's just helping reduce the popping from a y-pipe + silencer modification; I do not think I've gained a single HP/PS/KW.
Based on web heresay, it appears that BMW boxer performance know-how is limited to folks with racing programs, like San Jose BMW in the USA; more support and performance options appear to exist in Europe (eg. http://www.rennkuh.de). As for our R1150R.org group here, the most effective engine mods I'm aware of are those used by Oliver for his R1100R to yield solid rear wheel power and torque, according to his dyno chart. He has a distinct advantage of being close to the heart of the German boxer tuning crew, plus the aftermarket in Europe with all the cool parts.
For the rest of us, performance upgrades are mostly aftermarket exhausts (just for noise and some weight reduction), plus suspension upgrades. I've got one of Jens' fuel adder gizmos, but it's just helping reduce the popping from a y-pipe + silencer modification; I do not think I've gained a single HP/PS/KW.
Rockster#2, K1300S, S1000R (for sale)
-
hank
- Basic User
- Posts: 282
- Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:30 pm
- Location: On the Lost Highway, Scotland.
- Contact:
Re: Performance upgrades
I'm a rollin stone all alone and lost...............
Re: Performance upgrades
Thanks guys for your replies. Kind of confirmed my viewpoint on these things. A lot of cash outlay for very little return. Now that supercharger that has got me thinking....
Re: Performance upgrades
Raven,
the chip alone will not yield enough power for the prize you pay. These chips usually just enrich the mix and lift the rev limit. As chip is essential in conjunction with other modifications (pistons, camshafts, etc) but alone I would not recommend investing in this. If you are seriously looking into this you need to get hold of pistons (Pistal, Wiseco or Woessner), camshafts (wunderlich boxer boost camshafts, boxergarage camshafts) and a chip (Bludau, boxergarage, etc).
Woessner pistons, boxergarage camshafts and boxergarage chip together will cost you roughly 900 euros plus shipping (see the shop of boxergarage) and the result should be around 115 HP and around 120 NM of torque.
Check out:
http://www.wunderlichamerica.com
http://www.bbp.homepage.t-online.de/bmwe.htm
http://www.dieboxergarage.de/frame.php? ... 2=3&lay3=6 (only German)
Obviously cost for mounting these gadgets are on top (if you can't do it yourself).
As Wunderlich once wrote, these gadgets will turn your bike from a lame cow into a raging bull.
My old R1100R has 1150 cylinders and Woessner pistons, boxergarage camshafts, boxergarage chip, Bodis exhaust, Volair (boxergarage) and modified intake. And the result is a jump from the stock 80 HP to a now 110 HP and 119 NM.
Essence is, forget about the chip without these other modifications. And if you would like to buy a chip, only buy one from a known source (Bludau, boxergarage).
Brgds
Oliver
the chip alone will not yield enough power for the prize you pay. These chips usually just enrich the mix and lift the rev limit. As chip is essential in conjunction with other modifications (pistons, camshafts, etc) but alone I would not recommend investing in this. If you are seriously looking into this you need to get hold of pistons (Pistal, Wiseco or Woessner), camshafts (wunderlich boxer boost camshafts, boxergarage camshafts) and a chip (Bludau, boxergarage, etc).
Woessner pistons, boxergarage camshafts and boxergarage chip together will cost you roughly 900 euros plus shipping (see the shop of boxergarage) and the result should be around 115 HP and around 120 NM of torque.
Check out:
http://www.wunderlichamerica.com
http://www.bbp.homepage.t-online.de/bmwe.htm
http://www.dieboxergarage.de/frame.php? ... 2=3&lay3=6 (only German)
Obviously cost for mounting these gadgets are on top (if you can't do it yourself).
As Wunderlich once wrote, these gadgets will turn your bike from a lame cow into a raging bull.
My old R1100R has 1150 cylinders and Woessner pistons, boxergarage camshafts, boxergarage chip, Bodis exhaust, Volair (boxergarage) and modified intake. And the result is a jump from the stock 80 HP to a now 110 HP and 119 NM.
Essence is, forget about the chip without these other modifications. And if you would like to buy a chip, only buy one from a known source (Bludau, boxergarage).
Brgds
Oliver
Re: Performance upgrades
Oliver - thanks for noting the specific engine components and resources. I know you've done so previously here, but I was thinking about your bike mods during the past month and wanted to research some specifics. You read my mind.My old R1100R has 1150 cylinders and Woessner pistons, boxergarage camshafts, boxergarage chip, Bodis exhaust, Volair (boxergarage) and modified intake. And the result is a jump from the stock 80 HP to a now 110 HP and 119 NM.
Was the switch to 1150 cylinders just a simple swap? No changes in cam chains, tensioners?
What compression ratio are you running with the aftermarket pistons?
Rockster#2, K1300S, S1000R (for sale)
Re: Performance upgrades
Mark,
the cylinder swap is not overly difficult. Get yourself some 1150 cc cylinders (single spark). I got mine from e-b** (for 450 Euros if I remember well). Next the outer base of the cylinders (the part which goes into the engine block) needs to be milled down to 104,9 mm. That is the only mod necessary. I got this done by a local precision mechanical shop (cost me 80 Euros). The heads require no modification. Neither does anything else like cam chain tensioners and alike. Then plug-on ... I believe with the Woessner pistons the compression is lifted to 12.2 : 1. Or 12.8 : 1 ... I don't remember exactly. But that does not matter. The engine runs fine.
There is however a hefty price difference (here in Germany) between the different manufacturers of pistons. Woessner are the cheapest (cost per pair is around 370 Euros). Pistal (from Italy) are the most expensive (per pair around 830 Euros) and Wiseco in between (around 550 Euros per pair). There is another (German) brand called REC but I have not seen any prices for these. I believe they are in the range of Pistal pistons. All prices are "german prices" including the local VAT of 19%.
What you need to check is which piston rods your bike has. The earlier 1100 models did have cast rods which have later been replaced by forged rods. Don't ask me how to identify the same. If you are unsure get yourself some used rods from the R1100S (they are bolt-on and the S did always have the forged rods). Cast rods are no good for the use in such a powerful engine.
If you need any info just let me know.
Brgds
Oliver
the cylinder swap is not overly difficult. Get yourself some 1150 cc cylinders (single spark). I got mine from e-b** (for 450 Euros if I remember well). Next the outer base of the cylinders (the part which goes into the engine block) needs to be milled down to 104,9 mm. That is the only mod necessary. I got this done by a local precision mechanical shop (cost me 80 Euros). The heads require no modification. Neither does anything else like cam chain tensioners and alike. Then plug-on ... I believe with the Woessner pistons the compression is lifted to 12.2 : 1. Or 12.8 : 1 ... I don't remember exactly. But that does not matter. The engine runs fine.
There is however a hefty price difference (here in Germany) between the different manufacturers of pistons. Woessner are the cheapest (cost per pair is around 370 Euros). Pistal (from Italy) are the most expensive (per pair around 830 Euros) and Wiseco in between (around 550 Euros per pair). There is another (German) brand called REC but I have not seen any prices for these. I believe they are in the range of Pistal pistons. All prices are "german prices" including the local VAT of 19%.
What you need to check is which piston rods your bike has. The earlier 1100 models did have cast rods which have later been replaced by forged rods. Don't ask me how to identify the same. If you are unsure get yourself some used rods from the R1100S (they are bolt-on and the S did always have the forged rods). Cast rods are no good for the use in such a powerful engine.
If you need any info just let me know.
Brgds
Oliver
Re: Performance upgrades
Thanks for that Oliver. As you say its the only way to get a real performance increase. With the chip alone I have found it just changes throttle response only with no real horse power improvement.
Problem is, the cost of these conversions will definitely break the bank and would be divorced if her good self caught wind of any of this.....
Problem is, the cost of these conversions will definitely break the bank and would be divorced if her good self caught wind of any of this.....
Re: Performance upgrades
Raven, I hear you ... If my queen of hearts knew what I have been shelling out for all the mods on my bike I'd be slaughtered ...
Correct, the chip alone does not liberate substantial horsepower nor torque.
Brgds
Oliver
Correct, the chip alone does not liberate substantial horsepower nor torque.
Brgds
Oliver