BMW R1200R R1150R/T F800 K1200R R1100R/T R1250R RnineT Message Board

digga wrote:@ Cyclerob....BMW don't manufacture oil filters!! another company makes them and they are BMW branded.

And who might the manufacturer be?

Have used Mobil 1 in all my vehicles for a long time, put 30K miles a year on my cars, mostly business. At the 12K dealer service, started using Mobil 1 in the Rockster, discussed with dealer, and he said as long as I keep to the 6K oil changes, should be no problem at all. Only use BMW oil filters in the bike, and a K&N air filter, which is also contraversial. Have used K&N in my cars for many years with no ill effects, in fact , believe they run a tad stronger, but that is purely subjective.

+ 1 on the Mobil One. Just changed mine.

OU812 wrote:

digga wrote:@ Cyclerob....BMW don't manufacture oil filters!! another company makes them and they are BMW branded.

And who might the manufacturer be?

Thats what we need to find out..

About BMW making the oil filters . . . .
They don't make a lot of the bike's parts: Fuel injection, brakepads, transmission, battery, starter, instruments, alternator, etc.
It's the same for every car/truck/motorcycle mfgr.

What's important is that NONE of the car/truck/motorcycle mfgrs will have Fram make their oil filters!! The mfgr they choose for each part or assembly they out-source is very carefully chosen so the part(s) positively represent the vehicle mfgr. OEM oil and air filters are most often of above average or premium quality. I believe the BMW oil filters are made by Mahle.

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CycleRob wrote:About BMW making the oil filters . . . .
They don't make a lot of the bike's parts: Fuel injection, brakepads, transmission, battery, starter, instruments, alternator, etc.
It's the same for every car/truck/motorcycle mfgr.

What's important is that NONE of the car/truck/motorcycle mfgrs will have Fram make their oil filters!! The mfgr they choose for each part or assembly they out-source is very carefully chosen so the part(s) positively represent the vehicle mfgr. OEM oil and air filters are most often of above average or premium quality. I believe the BMW oil filters are made by Mahle.

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I wonder if Mahle make filters for anybody body else.?
as you say, lots of parts are made out of house to a certain specification as determined by the 'Company'.
There was a bit of uproar in the British bike press about Triumph. It turns out that a vast majority of there parts are made in Thailand and the Far East and then put together in Blighty
I can't see the problem myself with that..... but peeps were saying its not a British bike any longer... (which maybe a good thing!! The bikes are certainly better than of yore)

Digga

This was as far as I could get.
http://www.mahleclevite.com/p_lv_filters_of.asp

Just playing devil's advocate here. Another reason why a manufacturer might not choose a particular supplier is if that supplier will not cooperate with them in some way. -

Perhaps the manufacturer would like to sell its OEM products only through its dealers so that their existance is justified. In order to do this, a manufacturer will ask that 'their' product be given a different number so that it will not appear the same as any other in the supplier's range. Perhaps for an oil filter which is generally available from Walmart (or wherever) it will be given the number xyz123A instead of xyz123. It may well be exactly the same filter, but who, in these days of litigaqtion would actually stand up and SAY that they are the same.

Perhaps, also, a supplier might not agree to an OEM inflated price...... and wants it to to be available through its own chain of motor factors...

Just the other viewpoint and not necessarily the one with which I agree

Rog

CycleRob and I go back a long time, he is the master of hands on experience, and as such I hold a great deal of respect for him. I'm more of a jack of all trades which has had the lifetime opportunity to grow and develop within the design parameters of the products used in the service of internal combustion engines. There are instances where we might not entirely agree, in this instance I'm taking exception to the following comment:

One important fact that's overlooked is the stock BMW filter is designed for 20W-50 weight oil in a motorcycle engine (higher RPM than a car). Fifty weight oil going thru an AC Delco car filter?? It's going to internally bypass the oil (unfiltered) more often than you will know, without any indication that it is. That's why the additional nylon fine mesh bypass oil filter is in the BMW filter - - - which NOBODY ELSE'S FILTER HAS.

The first statement is not entirely true, as all oil filters have been designed for many years now to accommodate the multigrade variety of oils available in the market, I would accept that BMW could have requested additional features in their filter to satisfy their design criteria......but I seriously doubt it. I would venture to say that the screen is a feature of whoever is the manufacturer of that filter......

The second statement regarding 50 grade oil going through an AC Delco filter......is also not entirely true as it is happening today on just about every vehicle presently on the streets, as multigrade oils have been around for a while now, that’s the nature of multigrade oil.

Is going to internally bypass the oil......not entirely a true statement, unless we specifically know the viscosity, read, the temperature of the oil being pumped and the pressure the bypass valve operates at and quite frankly I don't think that either of us knows even what the bypass valve pressure setting is for the BMW filters.

Last, regarding the fine mesh in the BMW filter, I presume that it is to safeguard the engine from a specific mesh size of contaminants, but I don’t rightly know.....maybe somebody does.

For everyone’s edification:

The nature of multigrade oil allows operation at various temperatures, that being said one needs to understand the following:

10W40 oil will never have the viscosity of a straight 10W or that of a 40W, as it is physically impossible. Personally I don't know the limits but will research the answer.

In the case of a 5W50 oil, I would be extremely careful of the conditions that it is being used because a ~ 5W oil does not have the right viscosity to insure long time durability of parts that depend on the oil film to keep the parts from contacting each other. What you gain is easier turning and starting, however, if that oil doesn't heat up so that the viscosity increases to about 30W you will be doing some bearing/ring work on your engine. What I mean is don't under any circumstances load your engine until it has reached operating temperature as you will be taking away from its life.

Folks, it is all a marketing scheme, it is a well known fact that the majority of the component wear on an internal combustion engine is at start-up, to this add the low viscosity oil, as a solution to slow cranking in colder climates and now you begin to see that the ultimate winner is the oil company and the dealer which will be working on your bike earlier than anticipated.

Let me give you an example......MB uses Mobil 1 exclusively for all their models. I would understand so in the late models after taking into consideration the new machining techniques, technology and tighter tolerances, but what about those cars from yesteryear that the manuals called for 10W30 or 10W40, how can you possibly scoop those under the same umbrella.....yes, you get them to wear out sooner, so hopefully the owner moves up to a new/newer model. Yes, cal me crazy but that is what's taking place.....and I have written about this before.

Last but not least....the myth of auto vs. motorcycle oil.......it depends on the application, otherwise there is no difference. If your bike has the engine and tranny sharing the same oil, use the factory oil, as it contains an EP (extra pressure additive) necessary for the longevity of the tranny gears......if the bike has a dry clutch like the BMW's, some Ducati’s and Guzzi’s any good automotive oil in the recommended range is acceptable. BTW, I mentioned this item, earlier in this post.

I have used Castrol GTX 20-50w or the BMW brand 20-50w oil since the bike was new (delivery was in March 2002, it now has 66000 mi). Probably 75% of those miles have been on x-country summer time trips on 2 - lane asphalt.
I have changed the oil only every 3000 mi., (total cost so far for those is $99.71) and oil and filter every 6000. I missed 2 of the 3000 mile changes last summer due to being on long trips where the change intervals came when it was not convenient to stop and do it (I can be lazy sometimes), resulting in a 5000 mi. change and a 5300 mi change. The oil looked pretty done in on that last one (you know, black in color, as opposed to brownish).

When it becomes necessary to rebuild my engine I will take some pics and let you all know how well my plan has worked.

Cheers.

CycleRob wrote:One important fact that's overlooked is the stock BMW filter is designed for 20W-50 weight oil in a motorcycle engine (higher RPM than a car). Fifty weight oil going thru an AC Delco car filter?? It's going to internally bypass the oil (unfiltered) more often than you will know, without any indication that it is. That's why the additional nylon fine mesh bypass oil filter is in the BMW filter - - - which NOBODY ELSE'S FILTER HAS.
http://r1150r.smugmug.com/gallery/44666 ... 2#12189899
http://r1150r.smugmug.com/gallery/44666 ... 2#12189902
http://r1150r.smugmug.com/gallery/44666 ... 2#12189868

When it comes to smart shopping, few people will be as "thrifty" as I am. Sometimes only the major brands will do, like Sony TV's, Lays potato chips or Helman's Mayo. Most other times the less expensive stuff will do. When it comes to my bike's oil filter, for what it is and how long it lasts, there's only one choice for me. The real thing. Spend the $1.25/1,000 miles extra on the BMW oil filter and save money somewhere else!!!

.

I can't believe you choose Helman's mayo over Dukes!!!!!!!!!!! In light of this, I can no longer trust your judgement, and will have to have to look elsewhere for advice...

Next you will say that you choose Sunbeam bread over Maritta. Dark days, Dark days.

Corey

For the R bikes, it doesn't matter much....even the API Energy Conserving in the API donut is of no concern to boxer engines due to the clutch not being suspended in engine oil.

If you prefer dino oils, the Castrol 20W-50 is fine in summer climates.

If synthetic is your choice, Mobil1 15W-50 auto oil works fine.

As for filters, stick with name brands like Purolator that pay attention to the by-pass valve operating pressure, no burred threads (consider what a loose thread burr might do you your engine bearings) and offer robust filter element construction...no Frams please.

In cold climates, synthetics offer lower pour points and easier starting.