Qualities We Want of Moderators

[RandyRandy]

Fellow Members,

What are the Qualities that we want in Moderators of this board? How should they conduct themselves in their public postings and private messages with other Members of this board?

I believe that basic civility and respect toward other Members is the essential first requirement. I find this post of MCooperstein toward a paid member of this board to be a breach of that responsibility and I, as a paid member of this board, recommend that mcooperstein resign his role as Moderator on this board.

MCooperstein posted this in response to another paid member who was saying farewell:

I'm from New York... we say: "Don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out".... ya hear!

The original message can be read here:

http://r1150r.org/board/viewtopic.php?t=5021

The haughty attitute of MCooperstein and some of the other Moderators of this board is destroying the community and good will that have been built here over the years.


.

[Gord]

Randy - be careful. You are liable to be branded a thin-skinned, whining, annoying, cry baby.

[boxermania]

Randy.....your point is well taken specially if you don't know or have dealt with the person.

I personally have met MCooperstein twice, at the 2004 and the 2005 Beakster Bash. Yes, he is from NY and certainly expresses himself as such.....however that is only part of the persona/environment.

I befriended Marc and although we don't have much in common, other than the R bikes I found him to be honest, respectfull and a good all around guy.

Yes, I think that sometimes in the heat of the battle things are said that latter one wishes they would not have said.....but that happens to all of us.

My read is that this site has become complacient and is not as pasionate as it used to be....after all, how much can you talk about the bike, the mechanicals, the trips, pictures, etc......so thihgs have been moving towards Off-Topic items, Patrick's Playhouse with the jokes and pics....and ocassionally some interesting threads.

This site needs some cooling off and a shot in the arm.....to get it back on
track.

In closing, you being from Chicago, may I sugest that to you take some time off and make it to the Beakster Bash III and meet some of the people face to face.....Mcooperstein might very well be there......

Trust me, they are all good guys, fun to ride together and share a couple of days with.............

[collyers]

Also, FWIW, the "board" is NOT a democracy or any other type of "governing body", it is a sole proprietership or "tyranny", if you will. It's the king who makes the rules, and if anyone doesn't like the rules....

once rules start taking over a "discussion" site, the inevitable happens - the creative & wild members buck the system (& usually leave) and the rule followers stay. This is how other sites have failed, and although most do not rise from the ashes again, another "free thinking" site opens elsewhere and the cycle begins again, unless the ruling is kept to a minimum.

Just my experience & opinion.

[DSKYZD]

The destruction of community and good will on the board is more a result of the action of it's members than any comment made in frustration by a moderator.

This goes back to Dallara. He started making posts that were deconstructive, drew one of the moderators into some back and forth but wouldn't let it go. Doug stepped in and tried to make peace. This all went down outside of the board as it should be. After hearing from Doug, Dallara still did not let up and just over a week ago Doug came across a post by Dallara that made Doug give Dallara a 1 week time out. A 1 week ban from using the Dallara username. A stipulation for removal of the ban was that Dallara was write an apology for continuing to behave in a way he was asked not to. I think that thread is gone and it's deletion may have been an accident.

No apology from Dallara.

Meanwhile, Dallaras friend Darthrider took it upon himself to post the same announcement in several forums that Dallara had been banned. Darth's posts are what has brought this dirty laundry out for all to endure.

Still no apology from Dallara but he likes to post as a "Guest" and stir the pot.

Darth's howling about rules prompted Doug to write up some rules and now those rules have to be enforced. DJ has always posted pictures of bikini-clad girls. We've always preferred that those not pop-up automatically if they're in the main forum. Leeway that used to be given couldn't be given now because there were posted rules to enforce. So DJ was asked, apparently more than once, to comply. A further post of a bikini girl embeded in a thread posted in the main forum prompted Doug to edit his post and make a comment which he has apologized for.

Meanwhile there's a whole crew of you members that really are perpetuating this rebellion and blowing a lot of it out of proportion. Let us do our job and handle things quietly behind the scenes without having to air out the dirty laundry for the whole board to read. That to me seems to be a mature and respectful way of doing things because it has worked very well in the past.

We're moderators, we're just like you, no better, no worse, and certainly not perfect. It's hard to do any job when your every word and action is nit picked and criticized. That creates a lot of frustration especially for a job you've volunteered to do. We're gonna make mistakes, we're gonna say things we shouldn't, and we're gonna aplogize for it when we do.

And an apology is what has been asked from Dallara.

Gord, I hope you find this thread because I've tried to answer the question here that you posed in another thread.

Guys, there probably aren't many other boards on the net that would tolerate a lot of what has gone on here in off-topic lately. Many of your posts would get deleted in a heartbeat. Few places allow any level of criticism of moderators or the site owner. Don't you think we've pretty tolerant? Don't you see we're trying to do the right things? Don't you see we're not trying to destroy the board, but there are some here that would just love to see that. There are those that are just pleased as punch to see all this hate and discontent. I'm not one of them. I think it sucks.

I'm sorry for what is going on, but I'm still not sorry for any of my actions as moderator.


DSKYZD

[Doug]

BRAVO DSKYZD. Well said! Thanks for posting that..

[Boxer]

The haughty attitute of MCooperstein and some of the other Moderators of this board is destroying the community and good will that have been built here over the years.

I had to giggle when I read this...Especially after noticing this:

RandyRandy
Joined: 01 May 2005
Posts: 62

Yes, Mark is a good guy. And he wouldn't have said that had he not meant it.:-)

[Just a Guest]

“I'm from New York... we say: "Don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out".... ya hear!”

“I'm sorry for what is going on, but I'm still not sorry for any of my actions as moderator. “



I think the above nicely sums up the problems with the site. While the above response is so despicable in nature, it may have had some merit with someone who only posts cutting comments.

Bones has never made a comment, which was abusive to anyone; I don't think he knows how.

If I was from the South, I would also take exception to the “ya hear!” comment. But I'm not, I'm from New York.

[Doug]

“I'm from New York... we say: "Don't let the door hit you on the ass on the way out".... ya hear!”

“I'm sorry for what is going on, but I'm still not sorry for any of my actions as moderator. “



I think the above nicely sums up the problems with the site. While the above response is so despicable in nature, it may have had some merit with someone who only posts cutting comments.

Bones has never made a comment, which was abusive to anyone; I don't think he knows how.

If I was from the South, I would also take exception to the “ya hear!” comment. But I'm not, I'm from New York.

Hey Fganger, I thought you were leaving?! Maybe you just forgot to log in?!? Glad to see you back ol' chap!

[DSKYZD]

So when someone says they are leaving but they return and post as a guest only to try to interfere with any progress and healing what should we do as moderators?

Delete the post?

Call out the "anonymous" poster?

What you are doing is not constructive and to be honest I think is very childish.

I've personally opened up and am trying to create some dialogue that benefits everyone. Why do you want to derail that?


DSKYZD

[Just A Guest]

"Hey Fganger, I thought you were leaving?! Maybe you just forgot to log in?!? Glad to see you back ol' chap!"

I said I was going to stay away from the site for awhile. I wanted to think all of this over. Well I have thought it all over.

Just so there is no mistake I will log in and let you know my answer ol' chap.

[riceburner]

Guys, there probably aren't many other boards on the net that would tolerate a lot of what has gone on here in off-topic lately. Many of your posts would get deleted in a heartbeat. Few places allow any level of criticism of moderators or the site owner. Don't you think we've pretty tolerant? Don't you see we're trying to do the right things?

Actually most of what has been going on would have been viewed with total hilarity and completely ignored as just "life" and what happens once you open yourself up to the 'net public.

[mcooperstein]

I do find it kinda hillarious, in a sad kinda way... and Frank, if it's an apology you want from me...fine...I apologize. But just to set the record straight, I'm from New York, yeah, technically, I was born there and lived 22 years there, but I can say y'all if I want to. I've lived in the south since 1975. My kids were born here, my wife's a native...

So, if it doesn't offend anybody, "y'all come back, y'a here!"

Mark

ps - I *do* feel obliged to comment on DJ's blatant disregard for the rules of posting. His last thread "Thanks for the memories guys - DJ" contained 26 inline images, each about 175KBytes big. Now, if you do the math..that post alone was about 4.5 Megabytes big. Some of us do not (cannot) get high speed Internet and still use dial up modems. So, with a 56Kbit connection which averages no better then 5 KBytes/second it took me almost 15 minutes for that thread to open. Forgetting about the "content" (bikini clad women on bikes) request...Doug also has repeatedly asked him and others to NOT post piccies inline, but have links pointing to the image. It does two things...If I don't want to click and see a bikini chick on a bike I don't have to, and second, I don't have to wait 15 stinking minutes for the page to load!! THANKS DJ FOR BEING SO CONSIDERATE!!!!!

[DJ Downunder]

mcooperstein ( moderator) said

ps - I *do* feel obliged to comment on DJ's blatant disregard for the rules of posting. His last thread "Thanks for the memories guys - DJ" contained 26 inline images, each about 175KBytes big. Now, if you do the math..that post alone was about 4.5 Megabytes big. Some of us do not (cannot) get high speed Internet and still use dial up modems. So, with a 56Kbit connection which averages no better then 5 KBytes/second it took me almost 15 minutes for that thread to open. Forgetting about the "content" (bikini clad women on bikes) request...Doug also has repeatedly asked him and others to NOT post piccies inline, but have links pointing to the image. It does two things...If I don't want to click and see a bikini chick on a bike I don't have to, and second, I don't have to wait 15 stinking minutes for the page to load!! THANKS DJ FOR BEING SO CONSIDERATE!!!!!

G'day Mark...I had planned to take a few days off from posting until I read your comment shown above and I *also* feel obliged to comment.

First off...It is a lot easier to just post a link to a pic than embed it into the post...I'm sure you know that..

When posting a lot of pics on more than one occasion I have asked if anyone is still on dial up and no one said they were...if anyone had said they were I would not post pics like this because I know all too well what dial up is like...I had dial up for years before going to broadband...I'm sorry it took you a long time to see my pics...you should have said something in the past.

On many occasions I've had comments back about my great ride pics saying that it's great that I go to the trouble to post them in a way that they don't have to click on each link to a pic...so I continued to make the extra effort to do it that way.

As far as using a link to a pic...I understood that that was for a pic that might offend someone or show nudity...and I've also done that in the past.
I've posted warnings..I've tryed to do the right thing....really.

When I posted that new RR pic I was so used to posting pics my way and maybe rushing a little...I didn't consider that girl in the pic as offensive...there was no camel toe...no nipple poking out...it just seemed like the typical girl that you get at bike shows...I agree that maybe I should have posted that one pic as a link...I made a mistake...sorry.

When I received my warning from Doug he said "I'm not going to warn you again..Post it correctly..Whats your problem?...etc"

Maybe Doug caught me at an emotional time...maybe another time I would just have thought..Opps I did it again....or...Whatever...or even replied saying sorry Doug...but at that time I felt hurt...and that he showed no appreciation for effort I put into helping make this board so great...not only that..I felt like a pest..and the board would be better off without me.

If Doug had contacted me saying.."sorry mate..I've deleted that pic..just re-post it as a link and it'll be ok"...how easy is that..I would have been more than happy to fix my mistake.

I was going to post with a topic saying 'DJ's last post'...but after cooling down a little I changed it to the thanks for the memories' post...I did say that I was only 'considering' that it would be my last post...I though I would just think about it a for a while.

I was flooded with replies both on the board and privately with some words bringing a tear to my eyes...I was starting to think maybe it's not all that bad...and I do not want to let so many friends down...yes friends...real friends..some that hope to visit me one day...some that send me their old magazines...even home made dvd's of their local bike and car shows..how good is that.

I did see Dougs words hidden in one of his comments saying.." Sorry, Dj."

I was starting to think maybe I should contact Doug and thank him and apologize back because of the effect my post has had to his once great board...I was not looking to stir things up..get attention or sympathy..or cause people to take sides.

Then I came across your comments Mark...I now seem madder/sadder than ever...talk about not feeling appreciated...sheesh!

Doug has not repeatedly asked me not to post pics inline...in fact not even once...and in the past 4 1/2 years I've posted thousands of pisc..(more than one thousand pics from my own site and heaps linked to others)...and out of all those I only remember a few being removed..and never having a problem with it...Doug said he's told me 3 or 4 times...I must have a bad memory or Doug is confusing me with someone else...but still..3-4 times out of how many thousand...geees!

I would love to stay...I'm sure others that say they're leaving would also love to stay...but I think a few a few things need to change first...Maybe get Dave back as the one and only moderator...I don't know what the answer is...I'm not very good at putting my thoughts in words...I guess I'll just wait and see.

ps...Mark...sorry again FOR BEING SO INCONSIDERATE!!!!!... ...I have a pic for you... http://members.optusnet.com.au/~djp1/mypic1580.JPG

DJ

[DSKYZD]

Thanks for posting that DJ.

All of our tempers are running pretty hot lately with things going on. Don't give up on helping us work this out.

There's obviously confusion about what images are allowed inline and what images are to be linked to. Hopefully we can have some discussion about that so there is no confusion.

DSKYZD