Any minimum size limit for the MO driver test?

[macx]

Been riding bikes for ~45 years, moved to MO about the time the driving
test came into being.

Started working longer term jobs around the country (power plant construction)
and never got the time to take the test. My old 81 sat in the garage between about early 90's
and now. I rode some (rural) but not much.

Got an R1150 in 08, been driving on a permit (2nd one now) and
am laid off and at home so want to get this test behind me. I tried
it with the 1150 but no chance.

When I "observed" to the (very nice) test gal that the test wasn't
realistic for a big road bike, she told me she just tested on whatever I brought.
Sounded like a hint. I think she totally agreed but of course
couldn't officially say anything.

I found a scooter rental locally, but am wondering if I show up with a
i.e. 100cc or 125cc scooter if they'd test me on that. The rental place
website says a driver's license is req'd (doesn't specify motorcycle
license).

The MO DOT site doesn't say anything about limitations on the cycle
driving test other than there are different procedures or whatever for
3 wheeled bikes and bikes with sidecars.

Anybody from MO have any experience with that or know if a scooter would
be accepted by the tester?

Thanks!

[riceburner]

I have no idea about the US / state laws in this regard, so I'll hypothesise here :

There MIGHT be something in the wording of the relevant law about taking the test on an automatic (ie bike with no manually controllable clutch & gears). In the UK we have a set of restrictions like that - if you take the test on an automatic bike or car your licence is limited to automatics (IIRC anyway!).

I'd see if you can rent/borrow something light like an F650CS (Scarver)/Honda CB500/Suzuki GS500/Kawasaki ER500/whatever is available in the US at around 500cc no fairing, upright riding position, for taking the test on. That way, there's no argument, it'll be a "real" motorcycle (as opposed to a scooter), and they're light and easy to handle machines, ideal for a low speed handling review.

[ColumbiaBMW]

They must make the test harder down in southern MO, because I did the test here in Columbia and got a 95% with my R1150R, and I am certainly no Valentino Rossi. Maybe you should just ride up here and take it. It was incredibly easy and only took maybe 15 minutes. I can't remember everything I had to do, but I can remember it had the quick start and stop where you had to take off and then stop with the front tire on a square within a certain time, I had to go between cones and back within a certain time, and it had the slow riding test where you have to go a short distance, but do it so slowly it takes you like 15 seconds, or something like that.

[macx]

I was hoping you'd respond when I posted this thread. Thanks!

That sounds like the same test, and I would imagine the test would be
the same anywhere in MO. I guess that just points out the effect of
age - you had an easy time of it, I failed and, moreover, would not be
confident retaking it even with practice. At least with the high 1st gear
which adds another element, that of modulating the clutch while coping
with all the other elements of the test.

I'll stop by that scooter rental place and see if they have any more to say
about licensing. I've inquired at the local BMW dealer and they didn't
have anything even mid-sized, altho they said they'd arrange a "demo
ride" at no cost if they did. I guess I could at least drive by and see what
they have for trade ins just in case if it looks like the tester won't accept
a scooter.

I'll post the results of trying to use a scooter so other folks can know if that's
an option.

[ColumbiaBMW]

Well I'm in no way insinuating that I am better at riding than you, you've been riding years longer than me, I'm only 27 now, and still learning riding skills everyday it seems. So I don't know, maybe the lady giving my test was just nicer than yours, or maybe I did so badly she felt bad for me and just gave me a passing score . I wish I still had my Ninja 250 though, I could have let you borrow that to do the test. But I did the same thing you did, in that I've been riding since I was 18 but never got a license until I was 25, and by then I had already sold the Ninja 250 so I had to do it on the R1150R, but man I was missing that little 250 on the day of my test. Let us know what happens with the whole scooter situation though, I have a friend that wants to get his license, but unfortunately had to sell his bike, so maybe that would be an option for him, just rent a scooter someday and take the test with that.

As a joke, ride up to the testing facility on this since she told you she tests whatever you bring:
http://evosales.com/pd_super_pocket.cfm

[mozark]

I used an 85cc Kawasaki to take the test in 1968, but it has since changed. FWI, I think you will find that the m/c you use will have to be licensed. I don't think most scooters can be licensed.

[Gordium7]

Take the MSF basic course in your area.

Even with prior experience, you will learn alot more than you would think. I have seen "experienced" riders that did not conciously use counter-steering at speed (or even know what it is).

When you pass the course, you DO NOT need to take the MO State Driving skills test. (I checked MSF website)

This training is usually given on small displacement bikes (Nighthawks, Rebels, Dual sport 250's, etc) with manual trannies.

Passing the state test usually assures that you won't fall over and embarass yourself, passing the MSF class helps to assure that you won't kill yourself.

just my 2 cents

[ColumbiaBMW]

Gordium brought up a good point, shop around though for different groups giving the course in your area, one of the local dealerships here in Columbia was charging over $100 more to take the course, than a group in Jefferson City providing the course. I still plan on taking it some time even though I have my license for the same reasons Gordium pointed out, even experienced riders can still learn new things from the course. Looking at pictures though from their websites, and talking to people that have done the course, they use mostly Rebels and Buell Blasts around here.

[macx]

I fully agree that course would be a good thing to do -
IF I wasn't laid off and having to watch my pennies.

That scooter place only rents 50cc machines and they didn't think
that would qualify. I drove by the test station to see what, if any,
the minimum is, but they aren't open today.

I'll probly ride in and check with them tomorrow.

Taking the test with a large bike and having to maintain balance
and steering at ridiculously low speed is more a factor of age
and physical abilities rather than experience, at least IMHO.

You won't think it's possible, or at least won't realize just how much
it affects you, until you get up over 50 or so. It's amazing how much
upper body strength, balance, and coordination you lose as it slowly
degrades over the years. 20 years ago I wouldn't have thought
anything of it.

I'm in the (early stages) process of swapping to a low ratio GSA trans.
When I tried the test before, it was the slow speeds required that gave
me the most trouble with the high 1st gear. That should at least help.
But I'll find out the minimum, post it for everyone's edification, and
then see if I can find something smaller than will qualify. The local
BMW dealer was willing to give me a "demo ride" on one of his used
bikes to take the test with, so will check back with him as 1 option.

I've got the bug right now, so want to get it over with while I'm all
motivated.

[macx]

BINGO! Hadn't had any luck researching criteria from the motorcycle end
of things, so tried scooter.

Here's a link that explains it - scooter or motorcycle.
http://www.dmv.org/mo-missouri/other-types.php

Copying from that link -

Scooters and mopeds, if they fall under the category of "motorized bicycle," don't have to be registered. Missouri DMV officially uses the following criteria to define a motorized bicycle:

* Two or three wheels.
* Automatic transmission
* Motor with a cylinder capacity of less than 55 cubic centimeters.
* Motor produces less than three gross brake horsepower.
* Cannot have a maximum speed of more than 30 miles per hour on flat ground.

If your scooter can travel more than 30 miles per hour or has a cylinder capacity of more than 55 ccs must be registered as a motorcycle, and requires a motorcycle license.

NOW we know!

[riceburner]

I was hoping you'd respond when I posted this thread. Thanks!

That sounds like the same test, and I would imagine the test would be
the same anywhere in MO. I guess that just points out the effect of
age - you had an easy time of it, I failed and, moreover, would not be
confident retaking it even with practice. At least with the high 1st gear
which adds another element, that of modulating the clutch while coping
with all the other elements of the test.

I'll stop by that scooter rental place and see if they have any more to say
about licensing. I've inquired at the local BMW dealer and they didn't
have anything even mid-sized, altho they said they'd arrange a "demo
ride" at no cost if they did. I guess I could at least drive by and see what
they have for trade ins just in case if it looks like the tester won't accept
a scooter.

I'll post the results of trying to use a scooter so other folks can know if that's
an option.

If you're having difficulty with slow speed manoeuvring, try getting your clutch/throttle balance to a comfortable state (ie one where the bike can roll forwards at about walking pace), then do NOT adjust the clutch/throttle - but instead modulate your speed using the back brake.

It's a method taught here in the UK for slow speed manoeuvres,personally I wasn't taught it when I learnt over 20 years ago - it's more modern than that! But I had to learn it in order to teach it when I tried my hand at basic training instruction a few years ago. It works.

It's easier to maintain a smooth control of speed (no pogoing on the clutch), and if you set your engine speed at about 3000 revs you can use the gyroscopic effect of the flywheel to aid balance.