R1150R - local BMW dealer gave me one crush washer (my first oil change!) that was bigger in diameter than the one on the bike. Also, I found a 2nd crush washer on the other side of the oil line to the cooler. Do you always replace both? Did my dealer give me the wrong washer? And, 17 bucks for a dinky little oil filter is insane!
BTW, thanks for all the great advice on the rear tire - I went with Pirelli Diablo Stradas (bought on line - rear alone 60 bucks cheaper than the dealer!).
Question on Crush Washers
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Question on Crush Washers
2002 R1150R + 2006 Harley Bagger
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ProductUser
- Lifer
- Posts: 346
- Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:16 pm
- Location: Mesa, Arizona
The crush washer your dealer gave you is incorrect.
"I found a 2nd crush washer on the other side of the oil line to the cooler"
I don't understand where you found this.
You only need one crush washer for an oil change (oil drain plug). In fact, some people reuse the same crush washer.
As for the oil filter: This is one of those topics that often has a lot of debate. There are other less expensive oil filters to use; others will likely post their favorite brands. Personally, I use BMW oil filters.
Tony
"I found a 2nd crush washer on the other side of the oil line to the cooler"
I don't understand where you found this.
You only need one crush washer for an oil change (oil drain plug). In fact, some people reuse the same crush washer.
As for the oil filter: This is one of those topics that often has a lot of debate. There are other less expensive oil filters to use; others will likely post their favorite brands. Personally, I use BMW oil filters.
Tony
Crush Washer
Hi Guy's
Did you know that if you take your crush washer and hold it over a flame until it is red in colour that it anheals itself and is as good as new againe and you can do this as many times as you like and just keep using the same old washer
Paul
Did you know that if you take your crush washer and hold it over a flame until it is red in colour that it anheals itself and is as good as new againe and you can do this as many times as you like and just keep using the same old washer
Paul
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ProductUser
- Lifer
- Posts: 346
- Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 1:16 pm
- Location: Mesa, Arizona
Check out this thread re oil filters (one of hundreds):
http://r1150r.org/board/viewtopic.php?t ... oil+filter
http://r1150r.org/board/viewtopic.php?t ... oil+filter
The genuine BMW filters that I use, come with a crush washer kit in them.
There are some odd size ones in the kit, but I believe this filter fits a variety of BMW models, so maybe for a K.
Why have we got oil lines off?? to do an oil change??
The copper thing was something we learnt at school in metal work classes.
I think once you heat it up, you then cool it in water to refresh it.
I think the word is anneal, not anheal, unless it was wounded first.
There are some odd size ones in the kit, but I believe this filter fits a variety of BMW models, so maybe for a K.
Why have we got oil lines off?? to do an oil change??
The copper thing was something we learnt at school in metal work classes.
I think once you heat it up, you then cool it in water to refresh it.
I think the word is anneal, not anheal, unless it was wounded first.
2002 R1150R.
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joejeweler
- Basic User
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- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:20 pm
- Location: Upstate New York State
Anneal is the word,........and is common to do this when working with gold or silver material.
When metals are "worked",...........as gold or silver wire is when drawn thru a draw plate or rolling mill,.....the metal gets compressed and work hardens. Heating it relieves the stresses on the metal and allows it to be re-worked all over again. Otherwise it becomes springy and prone to crack.
A crush washer gets compressed when installed,......and in effect is work hardened. If reused i presume it no longer gives to adjust to the small differences in the machined surfaces of the oil plug and housing, and might leak. Frankly,.......i know i've re-used the copper washer on my 1982 Suzuki several times and never got a leak. I haven't changed the oil on my RR yet, so maybe these are more prone to leak if a new (or "re-conditioned") crush washer is not used.
I've never tried this with a crush washer,.......but as a longtime bench jeweler it makes lots of sense. I'd try it on my next oil change.
When metals are "worked",...........as gold or silver wire is when drawn thru a draw plate or rolling mill,.....the metal gets compressed and work hardens. Heating it relieves the stresses on the metal and allows it to be re-worked all over again. Otherwise it becomes springy and prone to crack.
A crush washer gets compressed when installed,......and in effect is work hardened. If reused i presume it no longer gives to adjust to the small differences in the machined surfaces of the oil plug and housing, and might leak. Frankly,.......i know i've re-used the copper washer on my 1982 Suzuki several times and never got a leak. I haven't changed the oil on my RR yet, so maybe these are more prone to leak if a new (or "re-conditioned") crush washer is not used.
I've never tried this with a crush washer,.......but as a longtime bench jeweler it makes lots of sense. I'd try it on my next oil change.
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joejeweler
- Basic User
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- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 10:20 pm
- Location: Upstate New York State
Not sure the cost,.....i haven't had to buy one yet and the guy i bought the bike from gave me 3 new BMW oil filters and 4 new cruch washers. So i'm set for awhile.
.........but i suspect new ones are a bit more than "penny's",......probably a buck or two each. I know i was shocked when i look at the parts fiche charges for simple bolts compared to what the hardware stores charge.
So if heating it for a few seconds on my ceramic block saves me a buck or two,.........the "per hour" savings for my labor are HUGE!
...........and i'll be doing my small part in saving out landfills from a massive buildup of crush washers.
Edited to add: I just looked it on on the parts fiche and the crush washers are listed at just $.50 each,........not too bad. But IF you need one right away and don't want to drive 40 miles round trip (like i would have to),......a simple heat up seems a better solution.
.........but i suspect new ones are a bit more than "penny's",......probably a buck or two each. I know i was shocked when i look at the parts fiche charges for simple bolts compared to what the hardware stores charge.
So if heating it for a few seconds on my ceramic block saves me a buck or two,.........the "per hour" savings for my labor are HUGE!
...........and i'll be doing my small part in saving out landfills from a massive buildup of crush washers.
Edited to add: I just looked it on on the parts fiche and the crush washers are listed at just $.50 each,........not too bad. But IF you need one right away and don't want to drive 40 miles round trip (like i would have to),......a simple heat up seems a better solution.
Very dubious savings here.
Crush washers do just that - They crush on use and hence form a seal as the raised lips on the washer compress against the uneven surfaces. Heating them does not restore the raised lips, just softens (anneals) the metal so that it regains a small ability to compress again. The raised lips will work harden and flatten when the bolt (or whatever) is done up (as they are designed to do), but it's far better to replace this cheap part each time with a new one.
I will often re-use mine if a new one isn't available, but their life is supposed to be a one shot affair. Why risk a leak in the middle of nowhere? Remember also that the torque setting on the bolt (or whatever) includes the crush effect of the washer. A 'refreshed' washer will not behave the same way and the torque value will not be correct for the assembled parts. The same 'value' may be achieved, but the actual mating of the surfaces will be different.
29 years in aviation engineering teaches you not to skimp on such cheap parts!
Crush washers do just that - They crush on use and hence form a seal as the raised lips on the washer compress against the uneven surfaces. Heating them does not restore the raised lips, just softens (anneals) the metal so that it regains a small ability to compress again. The raised lips will work harden and flatten when the bolt (or whatever) is done up (as they are designed to do), but it's far better to replace this cheap part each time with a new one.
I will often re-use mine if a new one isn't available, but their life is supposed to be a one shot affair. Why risk a leak in the middle of nowhere? Remember also that the torque setting on the bolt (or whatever) includes the crush effect of the washer. A 'refreshed' washer will not behave the same way and the torque value will not be correct for the assembled parts. The same 'value' may be achieved, but the actual mating of the surfaces will be different.
29 years in aviation engineering teaches you not to skimp on such cheap parts!
I ride an R1150GS Adventure with sidecar. IBA #39193
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DJ Downunder
- Honorary Lifer
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I have heard that BMW packages the washer with the filter. My dealer sells them separately however; $14.08 for the filter and $.35 for the crush washer. While the price is a bit steep for the OEM filter, it seems like the additional $.35 for for a new washer is money well spent.
'03 R1150R
Life member 365
Errabundi Saepe, Semper Certi
Life member 365
Errabundi Saepe, Semper Certi
I buy a new washer while I'm at the dealer buying the filter. Sometimes they ask if I want the filter 'kit', which includes the filter and washer. In the past I've bought 10 washers at a time to make sure I have spares. It's a cheap part when compared to the overall cost of an oil change - why skimp on it?
John
Member 293 (I think)
'17 Triumph Tiger 1200 XRX
Member 293 (I think)
'17 Triumph Tiger 1200 XRX
Not always. The last filter I ordered (via web) from A&S BMW didn't include a crush washer. A rep I spoke with said I had to buy it separately. Is the factory or dealer suppose to package the washer with the filter?johno wrote:DJ, got mine from Southbank last week. Complete washer set in filter pack.
When I asked for washers, saleman told me they came with filters.
'96 BMW R1100R
'05 HD Electra Glide Ultra Classic
'05 HD Electra Glide Ultra Classic
All true
Yes, I have re-used mine. But when I am at work with CL2, we always use new crush rings, as a leak would be really bad. Almost as bad as an oil leak. 
RIDE TOO PRETEND, PRETEND TOO RIDE. 
89 Oldwing, 07 WR250R, 14 KX250F
89 Oldwing, 07 WR250R, 14 KX250F